Hypothetical Digital Workflow for Creating Armor Replicas

[LaughingCheese]

I've been giving a lot of thought about how I am going to go through with this project. I've also been thinking about what I'm actually going to build.

I think I will keep classified what armor from which series I intend to build [Hint: At this point I think it won't be Halo; Halo was never really in my favourites list to begin with, sorry].

As I know nothing about working with modelling clay, nor fiberglassing, and don't have the funds to try each one out at this point, I've been thinking of how I could realize this project via a completely digital workflow; from inception, skething, making a model, then somehow getting to a mold, and then fiberglassing or something.

Here are some of my thoughts, I'm hoping this thread can be a repository of discussion ideas on this matter.

Again, here are some of my thoughts:

Since my skills in fiberglassing and molding are nill, I have been looking seriously at some sort of 3D printing device as the base for a mold, on top of which I would then fiberglass.

Here's the options at present:

1. Commercial grade 3D printers can cost thousands of dollars. Obviously, that's probably out of reach of anyone here.
2. Fab@Home: Is an open source 3D printer, still in the developing stages, so it can't do nearly what products of companies like Zcorp can do, although it brings costs down dramatically; probably around $1-$2000 for the whole thing assembled.
3. RepRap:: Another open source rapid protyping device in developing, even cheaper than Fab@Home, less than $500 to assemble.
4. DIY CNC: Then there's the DIY CNC route, although this would still be fairly expensive.
5. Then there's my idea, which is to build a somewhat dedicated device (it would beonly big enough to create the largest of the armor pieces, which is probably the chest and backplate).

My idea is to have a device that would cut clay into the desired form, and to make molds from that. This would achieve a near 100% accuracy, as the clay model would be controlled by computer, which in turn would get its data from a 3D model of the object to be cut.

Workflow

1. Make detailed sketchings of object to be modelled so that accurate references are available.
2. Turn the 2D sketchings into 3D models via 3d modelling software.
3. Send the 3D model to the cutting device.
4. The software on the cutting device will then determine how best to cut the model.

The cutting device will probably use modelling clay to cut unless I can find a better material, which is probably doubtful.

Maybe the mods could merge or delete some of my threads that are similar to this?

 

[Lordmagoo]

O that would be sweet. Though it would take all the art out of it

 

[LaughingCheese]

O that would be sweet. Though it would take all the art out of it

Maybe; I mainly care about getting the most accurate suite for the least trouble, and in my case, going through all this trouble seems worth it.

Perhaps you could say the art is in the preliminary steps of tracing, then extrapolating orthographic views, and then in modelling in 3D. So maybe the art lies in the preliminary details and not the final product using this method; although since the final product is an outcome of the previs work, that's kind of an oxymoron, or something...















And I don't really want to go the pep route if I can help it, especially if I can get better results by doing all this stuff first.

 

[Vrogy]

What you've posted has gone over the heads of about 70-80% of this forum, FYI.. even the veterans.

Here there's a sort of canon to How Things Are Done and That's Just How You Do It.
If it's new it's suspect until proven, repeatedly. This is pretty much survival mode humanity.

However, I recognize your genius and augment your legitimacy. This can work.

 

[SGT V]

I under stood it and this is proven technology.

The problem you will run into is the cost. These rapid prototyping technologies are very costly to get done from what I understand. These machine don't use clay. The material they use differs from achine to machine. Some layer polymers to build the shape, CNC carves away from blocks of plastic or foam. Regardless you will still have to do something to finish the piece and the material is not always meant to be worn. If you have the cash to do it, it is a great way to get a starting point for molds.

 

[drgon47]

The only problem i see with Fab@Home is that their materials list doesnt cover the materials we use alot of.

 

[Vrogy]

I under stood it and this is proven technology.

The problem you will run into is the cost.

CNC is cheap nowadays. Rockcliff plans, for example, cost about 300-400 to build, and end up with pretty decent capabilities- i.e. 3D shaping of MDF.

This would make a *great* base for molding- just mill it, seal it, mold it. The only thing I can see being odd is possibly making some complex jigs and using many, many very light passes to get the complex shapes of armor.. but then again, minimal supervision means you can play Halo while the machine does most of the sculpting for you.

 

[Sean Bradley]

CNC has been used by a few here to fabricate their original models. Thing is that it's expensive, and typically leaves some articacts from the process that still need to be cleaned up.

See Adams AR thread,or BishopX's helmet thread. Both of those were produced by CNC'd 3D files

 

[LaughingCheese]

CNC has been used by a few here to fabricate their original models. Thing is that it's expensive, and typically leaves some articacts from the process that still need to be cleaned up.

Well I figure a few artifacts to clean up left by a machine is better than a ton of artifacts that could creep in if I did by hand. You meant to say artifacts, right?

I'm don't even know what you mean by artifacts anyways.

You mean like air bubbles and such?

See Adams AR thread,or BishopX's helmet thread. Both of those were produced by CNC'd 3D files

Seen Bishop's thread, I'll have to check out AR's thread, thanks.

 

[LaughingCheese]

What you've posted has gone over the heads of about 70-80% of this forum, FYI.. even the veterans.

Really? I'm not that smart, when I was done typing out the thread I was like "whoa, that sounds really intelligent"

lol

However, I recognize your genius and augment your legitimacy. This can work.

Oo, that's major complements, thanks!

The problem you will run into is the cost. These rapid prototyping technologies are very costly to get done from what I understand. These machine don't use clay. The material they use differs from achine to machine. Some layer polymers to build the shape, CNC carves away from blocks of plastic or foam. Regardless you will still have to do something to finish the piece and the material is not always meant to be worn. If you have the cash to do it, it is a great way to get a starting point for molds.

Ahem, if you went to some of the links in my original post you will see that I am talking about relatively cheap home built CNC machines.

CNC FTW!

Oh, and maybe a mod could merge these two posts I've just made?

Thanks,

LC

 

[Sean Bradley]

Artifacts as in 'something unintended left over from the process used to create an object'

In 3D prototyping these can be as simple as milling lines that have to be sanded out, or as difficult as missing detail that the CNC couldn't replicate. I've even seen polygons in the texture of laser sintered models.

 

[Vrogy]

Thing is that it's expensive

This

Will do what this does

To moldable materials.. about the same, maybe slower.
The price difference is enormous.

CNC is not expensive anymore. Do some research.

In 3D prototyping these can be as simple as milling lines that have to be sanded out, or as difficult as missing detail that the CNC couldn't replicate.

When you look at it, what's harder- building a CNC machine for which the operation follows simple rules and a clear plan.. or developing the pure skill to make a pile of clay look like armor from the 25th century?

 

[LaughingCheese]

This

Will do what this does

To moldable materials.. about the same, maybe slower.
The price difference is enormous.

CNC is not expensive anymore. Do some research.




When you look at it, what's harder- building a CNC machine for which the operation follows simple rules and a clear plan.. or developing the pure skill to make a pile of clay look like armor from the 25th century?

Will that work with clay? I was thinking I might have to build a different design to work with clay.

I guess is that a cutting tool attached to that?


I'll chat more later, I'm off to school now, first math test for this semester today, w00t!

 

[Sean Bradley]

CNC is not expensive anymore. Do some research.

From what I've been told by Adam when he had his AR milled, it wasn't cheap. Thats just a weapon, not an entire suit. Thats my research.

When you look at it, what's harder- building a CNC machine for which the operation follows simple rules and a clear plan.. or developing the pure skill to make a pile of clay look like armor from the 25th century?

I suppose it depends what your strengths are. If you've already got some hands on skills but don't have the experience, there are resources to help you.. like this website. If you're more the technically minded, then maybe it does make more sense to go computer-aided. It does seem like a complicated means to an end result though from my standpoint. From point A to point B I never would have considered building a machine to help me make my costume. But then hey, look at Pepakura, it's done wonders for armor making. I wouldn't have guessed that either.

I've yet to see professional looking armor made by these DIY machines. Until someone takes the initiative to do so I suppose we'll all be guessing.

 

[LaughingCheese]

From what I've been told by Adam when he had his AR milled, it wasn't cheap. Thats just a weapon, not an entire suit. Thats my research.

What machine did he use, one of those big professional ones, or one of the DIY ones I posted about?

Probably the former I'm guessing...

 

[Adam]

it's not the machine that is expensive, it's the materials, the tool paths and such. Gun was $1500 or so

 

[LaughingCheese]

it's not the machine that is expensive, it's the materials, the tool paths and such. Gun was $1500 or so

Ah, I see, I was thinking of that; modelling clay, mold etc...oy.

 

[Vrogy]

it's not the machine that is expensive, it's the materials, the tool paths and such. Gun was $1500 or so

What.

What was it cut out of? I think MDF could work for props.
As for the tool pathing fees.. you can do your own, there are open source tools. Gcode is a widely understood standard..

If you paid around 1500$ for a CNC'd rifle.. I'm sorry, but you wasted a lot of money. I've seen an entire combat robot chassis CNC'd out of 2024 and 7075 aluminum, anodized, drilled, and tapped for assembly for half that.

 

[LaughingCheese]

What.

What was it cut out of? I think MDF could work for props.
As for the tool pathing fees.. you can do your own, there are open source tools. Gcode is a widely understood standard..

If you paid around 1500$ for a CNC'd rifle.. I'm sorry, but you wasted a lot of money. I've seen an entire combat robot chassis CNC'd out of 2024 and 7075 aluminum, anodized, drilled, and tapped for assembly for half that.

Oo...I just posted about MDF...maybe I should delete that?

I should really pay closer attention when reading posts.