Sanding, really gritting on my ****...

[OT7OM4N]

First off I'm from the UK so don't have access to bondo or plasti-dip or any of those transatlantic luxuries. I've finished fibreglassing and filling my helmet and now at the sanding stage. The body filler I used was Isopon P38 (fairly common one to use in the UK i think). I'm having trouble with a few things:

- going though sandpaper like its going out of fashion
- sanding in the smaller crevices of the design (its quite a high res model)
- getting a smooth finish (even on the larger, easy to sand parts)

Any tips or methods I could try?? I've been using 3 grades of sandpaper on a sanding block and a small sanding tool for a dremel.

Here are some photos (sorry they're sideways):

 

[Chernobyl]

First off I'm from the UK so don't have access to bondo or plasti-dip or any of those transatlantic luxuries. I've finished fibreglassing and filling my helmet and now at the sanding stage. The body filler I used was Isopon P38 (fairly common one to use in the UK i think). I'm having trouble with a few things:

- going though sandpaper like its going out of fashion
- sanding in the smaller crevices of the design (its quite a high res model)
- getting a smooth finish (even on the larger, easy to sand parts)

Any tips or methods I could try?? I've been using 3 grades of sandpaper on a sanding block and a small sanding tool for a dremel.

Here are some photos (sorry they're sideways):

I'm from the UK as well, and I share your pain regarding Isopon. Issue is, that stuff is not cost-effective - RobTC and I had a chat about this, and it's far better and more cost-effective for you to buy a gallon-tub of automotive filler from eBay. It works out that the US can get Bondo-branded filler for roughly $20 a gallon, whereas we're paying $160 per gallon ($40 per litre, roughly 4 litres to a gallon).

As for sand paper... yeah, that's a cross you're going to have to bear, I'm afraid. Even Bondo is a pain to sand, though if you're trying to get into small nooks and such, a set of needle files is essential. A decent-quality set of rasps and other files is also a good idea. If you're struggling with a smooth surface, consider how you're laying your product on - it seems as though you're getting quite a lot of air bubbles stuck in your filler as you spread it. Try to spread it as thinly as you can to avoid this, and use a decent-quality, smooth-edged spatula to avoid any marks as you're spreading it. Other than that... I can only suggest looking into spot filler later on if you're still struggling.

 

[OT7OM4N]

I'm from the UK as well, and I share your pain regarding Isopon. Issue is, that stuff is not cost-effective - RobTC and I had a chat about this, and it's far better and more cost-effective for you to buy a gallon-tub of automotive filler from eBay. It works out that the US can get Bondo-branded filler for roughly $20 a gallon, whereas we're paying $160 per gallon ($40 per litre, roughly 4 litres to a gallon).

As for sand paper... yeah, that's a cross you're going to have to bear, I'm afraid. Even Bondo is a pain to sand, though if you're trying to get into small nooks and such, a set of needle files is essential. A decent-quality set of rasps and other files is also a good idea. If you're struggling with a smooth surface, consider how you're laying your product on - it seems as though you're getting quite a lot of air bubbles stuck in your filler as you spread it. Try to spread it as thinly as you can to avoid this, and use a decent-quality, smooth-edged spatula to avoid any marks as you're spreading it. Other than that... I can only suggest looking into spot filler later on if you're still struggling.

Okay thanks for the tips, I'll try getting some needle files tomorrow. Think Aldi has them stocked at the moment on the cheap. Is it really worth laying on another layer or filler over the top? If I can get some plasti-dip or something similar will that fill in some of the gaps? Thanks for your help Chernobyl.

 

[Chernobyl]

Okay thanks for the tips, I'll try getting some needle files tomorrow.

That, or B&Q/Wickes. Either way, these are indispensable for the smaller areas.

Is it really worth laying on another layer or filler over the top?

Definitely. Sand off what you've got until it's as good as you can make it, and then do another pass - try to get the next one laid down as smoothly as you can.

If I can get some plasti-dip or something similar will that fill in some of the gaps?

I wouldn't recommend it. Spot putty works better, but for larger grooves and issues, your only recourse is another pass of bondo.

 

[OT7OM4N]

That, or B&Q/Wickes. Either way, these are indispensable for the smaller areas.



Definitely. Sand off what you've got until it's as good as you can make it, and then do another pass - try to get the next one laid down as smoothly as you can.



I wouldn't recommend it. Spot putty works better, but for larger grooves and issues, your only recourse is another pass of bondo.

Alright cheers, do you know of any filler that's thinner than P38 to apply? It was a right nightmare. Rondo worth a try?

 

[Bob Rosland]

If you find that your body filler is a little too rough after you've applied it, you can smooth out the larger chunks and pits with some acetone and a rag. Just be sure to do it before it dries completely.

Also, acetone is really handy for cleaning your files after they're clogged with filler, primer, or paint.

 

[RobTC]

If you're using sandpaper instead of coated aluminium oxide emery cloth, that's your first problem. If you're not using 60 grit (or lower) sheets and drums, you're wasting time on material removal. You can wet sand to 600 (UK, 400 US) grit later. Get a standard cheap set of files (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Rolson-24727-Engineer-File-Pieces/dp/B0031RS9T8) and a wire brush and acetone to clean them out with if clogging is a major problem. The coarse half-round goes through material like there's no tomorrow. Triangle files are your friend. Learn how to carve partially-cured Bondo with an X-Acto #11 blade.

Other Bondo application/removal tips are in my signature.

 

[OT7OM4N]

If you're using sandpaper instead of coated aluminium oxide emery cloth, that's your first problem. If you're not using 60 grit (or lower) sheets and drums, you're wasting time on material removal. You can wet sand to 600 (UK, 400 US) grit later. Get a standard cheap set of files (http://www.amazon.co.uk/Rolson-24727-Engineer-File-Pieces/dp/B0031RS9T8) and a wire brush and acetone to clean them out with if clogging is a major problem. The coarse half-round goes through material like there's no tomorrow. Triangle files are your friend. Learn how to carve partially-cured Bondo with an X-Acto #11 blade.

Other Bondo application/removal tips are in my signature.

Thanks, really comprehensive guide, I'll be sure to use it.

If you find that your body filler is a little too rough after you've applied it, you can smooth out the larger chunks and pits with some acetone and a rag. Just be sure to do it before it dries completely.

Also, acetone is really handy for cleaning your files after they're clogged with filler, primer, or paint.

Cheers, I'll give that a try too!

 

[hacxor]

I'm from the UK as well, and I share your pain regarding Isopon. Issue is, that stuff is not cost-effective - RobTC and I had a chat about this, and it's far better and more cost-effective for you to buy a gallon-tub of automotive filler from eBay. It works out that the US can get Bondo-branded filler for roughly $20 a gallon, whereas we're paying $160 per gallon ($40 per litre, roughly 4 litres to a gallon).

That is crazy! On high we pay about 40$ a gallon and on low 23$. I'm not sure about shipping costs to the uk, but I'm sure it would cost a lot less than 100$ to ship it there. I'm sure us american people can help out by sending some packages of supplies out there. Maybe if we have a large enough uk base of 405th members we can schedule a group buy.


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[Chernobyl]

That is crazy! On high we pay about 40$ a gallon and on low 23$. I'm not sure about shipping costs to the uk, but I'm sure it would cost a lot less than 100$ to ship it there. I'm sure us american people can help out by sending some packages of supplies out there. Maybe if we have a large enough uk base of 405th members we can schedule a group buy.

That's not strictly necessary. We can just as easily find decent deals online - the main issue isn't so much that cheap filler products don't exist, it's that the local hardware and automotive stores don't stock cheap filler. We're forced to get our supplies online if we want a decent deal, which can be an issue for members not wanting to deal with the hassle of online purchasing.

While I'm at it: the shipping would probably cost a fair bit, actually. A gallon of bondo isn't exactly a lightweight product, and overseas shipping charges can get pretty steep fairly quickly. Shopping internationally within Europe is bad enough sometimes, without going inter-continental.

 

[Achronos808]

I feel your pain. With my first suit, I hated sanding and I would go through a lot of sand paper and bondo. I was still learning how to bondo and sand. Best of luck.

 

[Meatwad]

Just thought I'd post to let you guys know, i picked up a gallon of bondo body filler at my local Walmart for $15.44 on rollback today. My jaw almost hit the floor when i saw it lol.

 

[shwarzwald]

Just thought I'd post to let you guys know, i picked up a gallon of bondo body filler at my local Walmart for $15.44 on rollback today. My jaw almost hit the floor when i saw it lol.

Yup. I was stoked when I bought that. Not even half way through using it yet. Should buy another on principle.

 

[mux213]

Have you guys thought about having a look at shipping from mainland Europa? I used to be able to buy Bondo like products easily enough from any automotive shop in Holland and its bound to be cheaper to ship from there then from the US.
Might be worth emailing the guys behind http://www.autoschadeshop.nl or http://www.polyservice.nl and see if they have the right product or have a chat with some of the Dutch guys on the forum who actually still live in Holland and can send you some stuff to try out or that they have personal experience with.

The Dutch word for body filler is plamuur. I used to use something like this: http://www.polyservice.nl/Poly-Plamuur-1-kg-p-16159.html when working on cars but as I've never used it for building suits its hard to judge if it would be the right product for the job but I remember it was real easy to sand.

I'm using Aqua-Resin for my work so I can work indoors which I've found very easy to sand but its less thick then Bondo but thats just to the side and probably a more expensive option.