Looking to get into 3D print armor. Complete newbie to 3d printing, any help?

[Rahksi]

Hey everyone. I'm looking to buy (and learn how to use) a 3d printer, especially for the use of making various cosplay armor (especially Halo). I've seen posts saying they've their armor is made from a 3d printer, but never found any information on what they used and how (and the search bar sucks). So I'm really looking for some information, I'd appreciate it. I'd like to get something around or under $500, and to use ABS plastic. I'd like to get a widely used printer with lots of support, and I guess FDM from research. Also, most likely a pre-assembled printer (unless it is fairly simple to put a kit or purchase different pieces and assemble). I assume since most affordable printers are smaller I'd have to print each piece in smaller pieces and glue them together, what's the best glue for abs plastic...a 2 part expoy (will this melt the plastic?), or super glue? Thank you everyone for any information you can provide, or if this endeavor is even worth it.

On a side note, I have experience in foam and pep, not sure if 3d printed pieces need to be reinforced with anything to be worn. I also never posted my finished ODST build, not that great (first attempt from scratch) but I had a blast:

 

[peterthethinker]

http://www.405th.com/showthread.php?t=44801


I know it's long. But In there Ive mentioned some useful data.

so ABS and PLA are OK
ABS is a Real eng plastic. it is stable after print with mild heat. It can be machined better afterward then PLA and can be polished with acetone.
PLA as you know is far more forgiving . .needs a less fancy printer... ( no bed heat no chamber ) so you can afford to get a larger bed .


Here is My recommended breakdown .... If you can afford it get a flashforge dreamer .( not creator !)


Its Ready to run as a modern inkjet....... super stable and has a wonderfull feature set
If you are gonna go with a kit........ get a prusa i3
its again a proven printer .

ABS has the advantage of solvent welding just like black ABS drain pipe!
Ive used a TAZ5 from reprap. many prusai3s and a printbot . the FF dreamer is dependable.
in my entire armor build I failed 4-5 parts! all were Me not setting stuff right . EG temp or bed prep .


If you box parts and do a nice thick wall you can get by with no reinforcement.

I used fiberglass "tape" in various sizes to shore up my suit . Dont use resin!
Use 2 part real epoxy. else it wont stick!

 

[hobbitdude13]

I'd recommend ABS plastic if you want strength. It is machinable and melts at a higher temp, downside being you have to have a printer with a heated bed.
I bought the DaVinci 1.0 because budget was my biggest limit, it isn't one of the best printers out there but mine has given me very few problems.

And as far as assembly, for ABS I've been using my eye/clamps to align, then supergluing to bind it together. I'm going to go over my seams again with some sort of epoxy like peter said.

All in all though, if you've got the money and patience (because prints do fail sometimes, 3D printing is NOT the "magic wand" some people make it out to be), then you can achieve some kick-ass detail.

Hope to hear more!

 

[Rahksi]

Thanks for the replies both of you. Im completely new so a couple of questions.

Is there a guide online of using a 3d printer for props/armor?

Ive seen a lot of people recommend the prusa i3 kit. Are these somewhat easy yo assemble? Im pretty handy/tech savvy, but with this investment id had to screw it up. I saw they are around 300 for the kit, that seems really cheap. Is there one better quality not too much more expensive/doesnt require any add ons for what i want to do?

How feasible is it to 3d print armor? How much time and material does it take? Are files readily available? How thick and stable are the pieces? I'm really not sure about the process. Any help? Does anyone have any suggestions as what to get?

 

[peterthethinker]

Thanks for the replies both of you. Im completely new so a couple of questions.

Is there a guide online of using a 3d printer for props/armor?

How feasible is it to 3d print armor? How much time and material does it take? Are files readily available? How thick and stable are the pieces? I'm really not sure about the process. Any help? Does anyone have any suggestions as what to get?

King rahl has some blender guides.
If you want I can make a video on my method.

Feasible? ......Yes but its risky time and moneywise . I did it in few months and about 600H of combined print and CAD and assemble time
a tad under 500 bucks in everything . * sans printer *

I used about 10-12 KG or so ...

The thing is . scale is everything........
with pep you can bake out a super low rez tester and then commit to a full rez .
with printing , unless you wanna spend a Year ! you need to get it to fit the first time every time . a chest takes 3 weeks .
Again its simple If you can test fit everything in the digital side of things....... remember boeing made the 777 all in software and it worked well on it's first flight.

I'd like to get something around or under $500, and to use ABS plastic. I'd like to get a widely used printer with lots of support,

500 bucks and consistent ABS performance on a larger part runs does not go hand in hand "most of the time".

There IS the DaVinci 1.0 ......... really nice unit!! ...Does ABS ......
you HAVE to use there Microchipped filament system.
They charge loads more then open reel filament.
the DaVinci 26-30 USD for 600 grams...
Vs retail FRYS price of 25 for 1000 grams..
and you can try almost any filament you want . Ive done HIPS . flex and PLA and ABS.

My suit took about 10 kg to make

If I Was to make my suit again on a the DaVinci it would cost me $450 In plastic
VS My machine I paid $225 ...

make a few suits guns and lids and the cost are more and more.

Its not a bad unit ! . but armor is the only thing that uses a TON of plastic to where the running costs are more of a issue then almost any other uses.......


if budget is tight and you are wiling to tinker the prusa is doable for PLA now and ABS later with a slight investment to make a box and fans ect .......


We only used the Prusa in labs for PLA and less fussy plastics.

If you want to just make armor and props .
The flashforge deamer @ $1100 VERY well supported .
It's what I have and when it dies I Will get the same one again .


Peter

 

[Rahksi]

Pretty cool. What is CAD?

How long is the life of these printers? Is there a video or post you'd suggest on the process of how these work? I guess there's a data connector for my laptop or something to upload a file that I want the printer to print? I'm assuming for like pep and all there is a program that converts 3d models to whatever the file format needed for 3d printers are?

So about $225 for just the spools of plastic, where did the other $275 come from in materials that you said it costed besides the printer?

So you're saying the prusa won't work for abs..I've read because it needs a heating bed and something else. How is pla for prop armor/weapons? Can you compare the thickness, weight, durability to something else?

And yeah, I want something very open that I have lots of options, but I also want something that I can get up and running decently quick.

Yeah I think $1000 is out of my price range...sucks haha

 

[Rahksi]

I think I read somewhere that the davinci only allows you to use the xyz brand filament that costs more?

It looks like the Prusa comes in a kit that you put together, I'm sure there are videos to help with that. Has anyone ever attempted to build a full suit of halo armor with it?

It looks like a lot of the lower budget printers have very small beds/workspaces, so it looks like you have to print in small pieces then assemble...right?

Again thanks for answering all of my dumb questions. haha

 

[hobbitdude13]

I think I read somewhere that the davinci only allows you to use the xyz brand filament that costs more?

It looks like the Prusa comes in a kit that you put together, I'm sure there are videos to help with that. Has anyone ever attempted to build a full suit of halo armor with it?

It looks like a lot of the lower budget printers have very small beds/workspaces, so it looks like you have to print in small pieces then assemble...right?a

Yes, the DaVinci filament is chipped, but I've accepted that for myself budget-wise, it's up to you.

And pretty much any 3D printing scheme will require "chunking" (as I've taken to calling it), in order to fit your print volume.
Far From Finished has an excellent series of Youtube videos for 3D printing armor, I HIGHLY recommend watching those to get a feel for the work you'll be doing.

CAD is computer-aided design, also. And no question is stupid! Ask away, if only because we want you to not make the same mistakes we did with this method of producing armor.

 

[peterthethinker]

also. And no question is stupid! Ask away, if only because we want you to not make the same mistakes we did with this method of producing armor.

SO true! ...... I really dont want to see others waste time .... printing does that on it's own



I spent at least 75 on fiberglass ( used only little of it. ) then the epoxy is 40 bucks a pair. bought 2 sets. used about 1.5 sets of epoxy.
I used a TON of superglue and catalyst . I started off heat welding parts with a 3D pen. but in the end used superglue.
I used many cans of pant . at 9 USD a can it adds up... I used sanding pads...
It all adds up.




smaller beds are not that bad.

Look at it this way . you have more points to align as every diced part is small. but If you fail a part its a few hours lost . ]
not some One large leg that failed at hour 38 out of 40 ........

the extrustin rate is kinda a fixed value........
prep time aside ...... there is no Huge speed difference in a smaller bed vs larger.....

 

[hobbitdude13]

One large leg that failed at hour 38 out of 40 .........

*hemorrhages internally* Ouch!

He's got a point though, smaller pieces leave less plastic wasted if the print fails.

 

[Rahksi]

Very good point! I guess i can appreciate a smaller room for error haha.

Are these fine to use indoors like in my bedroom? How loud are they? Heat output? Toxic fumes?

So the prusa i3 seems the most recommended for budget. How hard is the kit to put together out of the box? Would anyone recommend this for prop making or should i get a more expensive printer? What is needed to allow the prusa to use abs?

Lastly. How strong is pla? And abs? For various uses. Even utility.

 

[hobbitdude13]

I can't speak to a Prusa but mine isn't terribly loud or quiet. About the decibels of a medium box fan or slightly louder. PLA won't have a heated bed and I've been told the smell isn't too bad. ABS can smell, depending on the color. Because of the different dyes used, when heated they can sometimes smell. But an adequately vented room with a ceiling fan oughta keep the fumes from building up, or at least it has for me. I've used exclusively ABS because the melting point is 176 degrees F, which even if left in a hot car it won't sag or droop like PLA can. And it's as strong as you make it, like I usually have the thickness from 3 to 5 mm, which is strong enough for me to drop it on a carpeted and even hardwood floor without major damage occurring. That's all I can speak to having not used PLA. Have you, Peter?

 

[Torres]

If you need assistance in printing I print for people all the time. www.exoticdesigns3d.com is my site and it has my 3D hubs link on there if you have the files already. My printers are $2k printers so the quality is there. Let me know if you need help. I would also recommend the new daVinci 1.0 pro for $700 as its open source meaning you can buy any brand filament which will save you money in the long run.
As far as ABS plastic goes I would stay away from the cheaper stuff unless you have a very well ventilated area due to smell. I hear matterhackers abs doesn't smell and it's cheap and I use Zortrax ABS and it is smell free. If you have any question feel free to let me know and I will help you out as much as I can.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[peterthethinker]

I can't speak to a Prusa but mine isn't terribly loud or quiet. About the decibels of a medium box fan or slightly louder. PLA won't have a heated bed and I've been told the smell isn't too bad. ABS can smell, depending on the color. Because of the different dyes used, when heated they can sometimes smell. But an adequately vented room with a ceiling fan oughta keep the fumes from building up, or at least it has for me. I've used exclusively ABS because the melting point is 176 degrees F, which even if left in a hot car it won't sag or droop like PLA can. And it's as strong as you make it, like I usually have the thickness from 3 to 5 mm, which is strong enough for me to drop it on a carpeted and even hardwood floor without major damage occurring. That's all I can speak to having not used PLA. Have you, Peter?

Ive never had issues with bad smalls Except the one time I used tresume hairspray Vs aquanet as its all I had on hand ...... Oh man it smelled like a hair salon in a heat wave! BAD !!!!!

My machine also has dedicated vent fans that with a printed adapter could piped to 4 inch duct to a window.


ABS is sweet! I am LOVING the acetone wash! .
HIPS is something I wanna dial in as It means super useful supports .
Ive been drafting my parts to be ran at 100% and Ill put the extra meat on the part in CAD and not as infill. I have more control and frankly lve got better results this way .

I am Really excited ! I may have a new contract with a firm in town, they make boots and are buying a 5 figure Z crop machine. I visited them at lunch today and they need me to setup there system and get them in to printing .

 

[RobotChicken]

What printer(s) are recommended for ease of use, small layer thickness (higher detail), and low to moderate filament costs if the budget was increased above $500, say $1K-$2K? I've been considering 3D printing some of my stuff because it would be faster than pepping and have better/crisper detail, but like the original poster it's a little overwhelming choosing a printer with so many different brands/models/features/etc out there. I did some initial research on Google and ended up no better off than before I started. :confused

 

[peterthethinker]

start with what materials you wanna print.
PLA only or also ABS HIPS FLEX metal

If you can swap hotends you can use exotic stuff with ease

support is a huge issue. parts and Software.
If it takes off the rack NEMA motors and hotend parts you should be golden. its not likely you will crisp a board. more often its a heater or a motor driver.

( did the EE who made it heatskink it right! ?) some lack heatskinks and a thermal mess !

I had a printbot Jr as my first machine,

when it died I looked at a few machines .
the makerbot 3 Grand ! Owtch!
the TAZ 2250 also owtch but its a large bed so its price is fair! just too high at the time for me and its not enclosed
and the Prusa kits. also not enclose and a prusa kit is 500 bucks. I could afford 1300 at the time so wanted more .


I wanted to have 2 nozzles for supports or IN the future I can stick a huge nozzle ( .7)for fast and ulgy and a small (.25) for outsides.
Or in my case it can be used as a spare in case of a clog or heater failure.
I wanted a enclosed machine so that ABS is doable on a large scale .
wanted to NOT need a PC to print. and therefor have a LCD screen to browse files .
I did not want Micro SD . as they are not made for constant Xfer use . SD or USB host was wanted)
WiFi was not needed but would be welcome .


I looked at the FF dreamer . what really got me was that dremel uses there machines as a rebranded model ( non heated bed single noz) for 999USD

I trust dremel they have been around a LONG time . If they were willing to slap there name on a product I expect they did homework on flashforge.


most printers are based on a simple atmel micontroller and dont store files on there memory
they run as a USB to Serial converter to bang bits to the machine in real time...
If you have a glitch on your PC you can bork a print ! the old printbot was like this what a nightmare !
the FF Dreamer stores the file and then reads it from internal memory.
Like Real inkjets do and commercial printers .

dont bother with the creator or pro.
its not bad!!! but it costs more then the dreamer and it uses the Old serial /USB idea of data transfer . for $1000 I expect a true USB device..
Yes the pro is more hackable... its IMO more clunky interface.
its a expert machine that is a great base to tinker with.

Franky If i was pressed to get a new box today.

http://us.xyzprinting.com/us_en/Product/da-Vinci-1.0-Professional 200 200 200 BUT single nozzle!!! 600-800 bucks

Or the Dreamer
http://www.amazon.com/Flashforge-Dreamer-Printer-Extruder-Enclosed/dp/B00JRBQJ6W 230 x 150 x 140 with 2 nozzles 1100 USD

they say the Dreamer cant take other filament .. they are wrong. is the internal spool holders that cant fit Real 1kG spools .

print a holder for the printer ! problem solved.

 

[RobotChicken]

I'll read up on the Flashforge Dreamer - thanks.

 

[Rahksi]

I'll read up on the Flashforge Dreamer - thanks.

This is an old post of mine, since then I have bought the FlashForge Creator Pro. Peter, why do you say don't bother with the FFCP? Of course, the Dreamer is a great machine from what I know, but I got the Creator Pro for a few reasons. Metal alloy body vs. (high quality) plastic, spool holder on outside instead of awkward inside (also, you can print different sized spool holders for different brands of filament), I also didn't like the lcd touchscreen on the dreamer, and I prefer the use of the SD card on the creator pro, but that's just opinion.

RobotChicken, I would suggest looking up unboxing, or in use videos of both printers and see which one you'd like to interact with the most day to day.

 

[peterthethinker]

If you use the SD card then the Serial issues are not a issue .

most folks I know use there machines with a computer attached and that is where it IS a problem.

I can plug in dump a file and unplug and walk my laptop away
Or If the PC decides to update then it also is safe.

Arduino Comport Serial to USB based machines need a PC at all times to bang bits.
Or they need to use a Precompiled G code on a SD card .

I never used the internal spool holder for more then a day.
Day one I made a new one for the back . . poped a few careful holes in the case and volla I can fit any spool I want under 5kG.

I ve made a new one for 5kg spools so in the new year I can get 5kg for $100 bucks

 

[RobotChicken]

Well, I ended up ordering a Dremel Idea Builder. The price was fair (saved $100 being on sale) and the print quality looks very good - nearly no lines at highest resolution setting. It can also print without being connected to a computer.