European Logo / Banner

Discussion in 'European Regiment' started by m073, Mar 14, 2015.

  1. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    Clearly some explaining needs to be done, and there's a lot of work you guys up on the Regimental Staff level have to do to pacify the Regimental communities - I for one won't be satisfied with an 'oopsie, we messed up, but here's your logo anyways' this time. You guys want to do something for the community, you engage with the community - you don't take all of the hard work these people have put into designing these logos and then throw it away without consultation simply to fit your own views on what the Regimental heraldry should be. Giving three or four people complete control over the logo design completely invalidates the purpose of our initial design process. That's a massive slap in the face to everyone who participated in designing these logos in the first place, and I'm very disappointed in you.
     
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  2. Art Andrews

    Art Andrews Community Owner

    I am sorry to see you are disappointed and also sorry to see that you don't like the process we have taken, but it is the process that was taken... the past tense being the key part of that. The logos are done. No amount of explaining will pacify those who don't want to be pacified, so we will simply have to bear the weight of your disappointment.

     
  3. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    A crushing responsibility, I'm sure, with no small amount of sarcasm inferred from your statement.

    No. This isn't acceptable. Staff or no, this is absolutely unacceptable and I refuse to abide by this. You don't simply take months of hard work from members, scoop it all up, and then fiddle with it behind closed doors as you see fit - and you certainly don't get a free pass simply because the decision was 'already made'. This isn't a matter of 'pacification', I already explained that I (as well as a number of other people) would have been fine with editorial alterations to the Regimental logo had the community been involved with the process. Instead, we've pretty much invalidated the last few months of work and decent designs by hard-working members, simply to fill some criteria. As I've already said, I've seen quite a few designs now that completely bypass the original spirit of the final logo decided upon by the community - do you not think that the people involved in the design of those logos deserve some input on their creations?

    I understand that some quality control is due with the designs that were presented. I don't mind this - I even expected it. But for liberties to be taken with these designs without consultation of the target audience for those designs, is absolutely unacceptable. You don't get a free pass for saying 'out of my hands, decision already made'. I'm sorry to have to dig my heels in on this one, but it's non-negotiable. Don't take a community project out of the hands of the community - I think that, at the very least, an apology is due to the involved communities for having the past few months' worth of work completely invalidated. That's a huge slap in the face to a project that was originally focused upon bringing communities together.

    Sorry to have to dig my heels in like this, but this has really diminished my faith in your ability to run this site fairly and with consideration towards the communities that comprise it. You've got some work due on rebuilding that faith.
     
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  4. Art Andrews

    Art Andrews Community Owner

    No sarcasm intended. I am simply not going to engage you again on a matter in which you will not be appeased, so what other choice do I have than to endure your disappoint... for a logo you have yet to even see.

     
  5. Masky

    Masky

    We should wait until its here and then decide if we need the torches and pitchforks :D
    But it would be a shame if all we did was just ignored since a lot of people (including me) really put some thoughts and work into it.
     
  6. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    I already gave you a great way to start 'pacifying' those of us that think your decisions were a little... oh, what's that term....? Pants-on-head?

    Saying 'I'm the admin, I call the shots, tough nippy' doesn't really cut it, and it shows exactly how much consideration you give to the community when you fire off like this. If you'd wanted bespoke designs fit for purpose from the start, why not cut out the middle-man and just have Asgardianhammer do all the work from the beginning? No fuss, no arguments, no toes trodden on. Just clean, fit-for-use designs without any fuss. Nobody'd have thought the worse, you'd have been hailed as a hero for providing some great designs we could all use.

    But, since these were community-driven projects, one would be led to assume that that's the way they'd end. Y'know - as community-driven projects. As something the entire Regiment could be involved in and be proud of.

    Whether or not I like the Logo the European Regiment is presented with is entirely irrelevant - don't deflect the discussion. That's relevant is that:

    ONE: A community project has been taken away from community control
    TWO: other Regiments are showing their displeasure at design alterations without consultation

    Maybe we don't all have to like the logos we're presented with. I'll settle for that - but I'd definitely appreciate, next time, being given a voice to decide on how I'm represented, rather than having somebody assume they know best for me.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2017
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  7. Art Andrews

    Art Andrews Community Owner

    You were given a voice. You elected a Regiment CO to represent you in such matters and they did.
     
  8. Art Andrews

    Art Andrews Community Owner

    Definitely weren't ignored and I hope you will be pleased with the final result which does have a number of the elements in some of the designs that were uploaded here.
     
    Masky likes this.
  9. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    Funny. I don't recall ever putting a vote in for the European CO. In fact, I recall still heading up Excalibur at the time of voting in Regimental powers. Your point is invalid.

    Regardless of the fact, that still doesn't excuse completely diverting the purpose of this exercise from 'guys, make up your own logos and we'll do minor quality control' to 'let's just make our own, shall we?'

    So much for 'we should only need to tweak the designs slightly and get them into a decent format'. We've gone from 'small fixes' to 'entirely redesigning the logos for you' - are you beginning to see exactly why I'm so angry at you?

    I do understand that you can't please the majority. But 'we can't please everybody' should never be followed up by 'so we'll please nobody' - you've completely missed the entire point of what made this a group-based thing that everybody could be proud of, and given total control to two or three people to do with as they wish. May as well have just not bothered in the first place, especially in the instances where the finalised logo will only bear a cursory, passing resemblance to the logos the communities worked hard on producing. It's a massive kick in the teeth, in particular, to the winning artist whose designs were chosen - yeah, great, good work, now let's just... Yeah, this needs to go, that needs to go.... And before you know it, the Mona Lisa's wearing hip threads from Hot Topic and designer Gucci glasses.

    Starting to see my point?
     
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  10. nintendstroid

    nintendstroid 405th Regiment Officer

    Well can i still say goodmorning?

    I seemed to have missed some stuff while I was asleep.
    I finally got the go ahead to reveal the logo.
    You can judge it yourself.
    405th lockups all-01.png
    European MASTER_FINALS_061515 OUT.png

    we will be receiving a banner and some promotional material aswell.
    For now only one for europe and we will look into getting more since one is not gonna cover it all and shipping that stuff between us is crazywork.
     
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  11. eskayp

    eskayp

    Hey nintendstroid,

    hope it's not too late for my feedback on the logo.

    I like the shape of the logo itself and of the eagle. But I'm concerned about the size of the "405th", which in my opinion should be a main part of the logo. One main object is to express the affiliation with the 405th. But if you watch the logo from distance, that part is not recognizable any more, while the EUROPEAN is huge.

    Also someone pointed out, that the logo won't work on dark backgrounds, e.g. my black armor. So you might suggest an outlined or negative alternative of the logo. That would be great!

    Cheers
    Kai alias eskayp
     
  12. Masky

    Masky

    At least we don't have a N missing like the Aussies :D
    I like the Logo. Some things could be better and more european but I can see myself putting this on my suit an be proud of it!
     
  13. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    I'll follow this. I don't recall an eagle being a core component of the European flag, nor am I entirely sure where the lightning bolts are coming from.

    How did we go from this:

    [​IMG]

    To this:

    Av57AEq.png

    The mind boggles.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. m073

    m073

    Hey,

    i like it, it has an eagle, lightning, stars, the form someone wanted and nice colors.

    I thought we would decide what logo we want, but this logo is nice.

    With a white/grey line around it can also be printed on dark things.

    I know how much work it is to run a community, so i´m just happy that we have a logo now.
    I don´t care if we were able to choose everything or were be involved in every step.
    But i understand that some are dissapointed that they were not asked about it until it was finished.

    After some years there will be more system in all of those processes, then less dissapointments ;)
     
  15. Chernobyl

    Chernobyl

    I don't mean to start an argument with you, but this sort of outlook is how these sorts of problems begin in the first place.

    I really don't mind the look of the new logo, in and of itself. What's got me fired up is that this was meant to be a community project, and that the ability to choose our own colours was taken away.
     
  16. m073

    m073

    Hey,

    yeah we weren´t able to choose anything for the final logo, we just could give some input of our vision of the logo before it was made. And i see they put a lot of our ideas in the new logo.

    So yes, next time would be nice to know before how the whole process works, but now it is done. Fighting (Crying) won´t help to make anything better. ;)
     
  17. Art Andrews

    Art Andrews Community Owner

    Now that the design phase is complete, Asgardianhammer is hard at work, creating identity guides for you that will have variations of the logo, much like you see in the Division Identity guide so that the logo can be used on different color backgrounds and in different applications. Shouldn't be too terribly long before those are released.

     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2017
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  18. Masky

    Masky

    It looks cool, even if it's not 100% what we wanted and lacks the stars but I can identify with it. Somebody worked hard at it so we shouldn't only write bad stuff about it but be thankful the whole Division has logos now that speak the same design language.
     
    m073 likes this.
  19. nintendstroid

    nintendstroid 405th Regiment Officer

    There seems to have been some miscommunication about the logo submisison.
    This all because we are quite a fresh and new group.
    The logo that we have before us now has taken stuff we have submitted in this thread as insipiration and got formed into one identity with the rest of the 405th.
    Some things where just not compatible as i can gather.

    We (me and my XO ) got to see the logo a bit earlier last week.
    We decided that it looke pretty good and aplauded Asgardianhammer for all his work and effort he put into it.

    I hope you can stand behind me and the XO's choice to be content with the logo that fits all of the 405th and its identity
    You guys apointed me and Wayne for a reason right.
    Hope you guys can stand behind us on this.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 22, 2017
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  20. CommanderPalmer

    CommanderPalmer Membership Officer

    To be honest I recently viewed the logos and banners and I have to say I *LOVE* the European logo.
    The best one and I can't get enough of how COOL it is :D

    Av57AEq.png

    I was just curious, does anyone of the European 405ths wear it on the armor and represent 405th?
     
  21. m073

    m073

    The question is more like, who does not :)
     
  22. CommanderPalmer

    CommanderPalmer Membership Officer

    Only asking because I've never seen any logo on the photos I've looked on. xD
     
  23. m073

    m073

    Hey,

    on photos i often don´t see it also but i know from the meetings everybody has one somewhere :D Perhaps we should put it all on the same spot? If possible.
     
  24. DatedRhyme713

    DatedRhyme713

    Im sorry but this is too cool mind if i make it my lock screen ?


     
  25. Bonepunk

    Bonepunk

    Sure no problem. :thumbsup
     

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