Experimenting With Mud Glassing

[sdhoigt]

Ok, first of all i would like to say i am still a noob, and this helmet is just being mudglassed for a trial (after my fail at regular glassing) , and these are my findings.... but i believe there are some questions some people will ask first



also, i am not finished the mudglassing process, i have done half the helmet





first of all, you are probably asking "what is mudglassing?"



A: mudglassing is when you use "mud" (formula below, thanks to Xtremetactics101) used with fiberglass. this is intended to be a reinforcement method which allows for detailing with little to no bondo.



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Rondo Glassing Reinforcement Method:



-50% Resin/50% Bondo

-Resin hardener



Used for reinforcing the inside of a helmet/armour part.



PROS:

-Moves easily when sloshed around

-Soaks into fiberglass very well

-Extremely strong



CONS:

-Hard to sand

-Very runny (Hard to control)



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Now for the "how do you do it?" section:



(what i did before was i had one medium thickness layer of resin on the outside, which had an entire winter to cure in my bedroom )

1. prepare your materials
2. put on your safety equipment
3. measure out the resin and the bondo at a 1:1 ratio in separate cups
4. pour resin into bondo (easier to mix that way) and mix, which will make a sickly yellow gray coloured liquid... aka MUD!
5. add the resin hardener to the mix... and no i do not have a proper ratio... so just put enough (i put 10 drops for 8oz of mud)
6. mix like crazy, and make sure you do not go easy on it.
7. pour into piece
8. slush it round the area you want
9. place medium sized pieces of fiberglass (i used matt, but cloth should work too), and press into place
10. (optional) mix up another small batch and pour onto fiberglass for extreme saturation, and smoothing for less work in the future
11. let cure

now for my findings:

• i personnally found it very easy to control
• very hard (but i placed 2 layers of matt on it, so of course its hard)
• soaked the fiberglass very well
• it was fairly thin, so i believe i will still need bondo
• multiple coats needed for heavy detailing
• very fast to do (did a quarter of my helmet in <10 min
• heavy
• id think that it would take a paintball, but im not recomending it
• easy to smooth with sandpaper, but i have yet to take a dremel to it
• very good technique for beginners

So i'd like to say i recomend this method, and i am looking forward to do the rest



now for pics!



inside

outside (darker parts is where i have mud glassed)

inside again

 

[HaloGoddess]

I was going to use this method at first until I learned about rondo. I really hate working with the fiberglass because it's so messy and little pieces of fiberglass end up all over my yard in the grass.

 

[mchammertime]

I was going to use this method at first until I learned about rondo. I really hate working with the fiberglass because it's so messy and little pieces of fiberglass end up all over my yard in the grass.

That's me

 

[iron mang]

do you recommend this method over the traditional way of fiber glassing? I hated fiber glassing the inside because the cloth kept on getting stuck on my fingers and it took forever to do, and it was extremely difficult to get in the small edges.

 

[sdhoigt]

yes, i would definitly go with this over regular fiberglassing. you will still get a slight sticking problem, but if you add a bit of mud on top of the fiberglass, and grab a plastic spoon or something, use the spoon in a smooth steady motion and you won't get that problem. and for the details and edges, the mud automaticly fills them in when you slush it around

 

[AlexSpartan177]

I was going to use this method at first until I learned about rondo.

Sorry to sound like a n00b, but

Is there a difference between RONDO and mud glassing???

 

[sdhoigt]

Sorry to sound like a n00b, but

Is there a difference between RONDO and mud glassing???

well, rondo is a term for just the actual mixture of resin+bondo, or the using of rondo in any detailing or just a rondo reinforcement using a 4:1 bondo:resin (with bondo hardener) , while mud glassing is when you use the rondo (or more specificly a 1:1 ratio rondo) with fiberglass



(by request of the original author (xtreme tactics101) the information which was previously featured here has been taken down and will be seen on his planned rondo tut)

 

[GMer56]

In my dad's day this was known as "cat gut" (I believe, the 80's were a crazy time).

Your information is interesting. When (and if) I make my armor the usual way (using fiberglassed pep base) I'll keep this in mind.

I don't think that it would stand up to a paintball, but perhaps these would:

 

[AlexSpartan177]

well, rondo is a term for just the actual mixture of resin+bondo, while mud glassing is when you use the rondo (or more specificly a 1:1 ratio rondo) with fiberglass



there are multiple types of rondo and uses for the individual rondo types... this was given by X-T 101

Well I was kinda confused

I always thought Rondo and mud where the same but HaloGoddes kinda confused me

 

[sdhoigt]

Well I was kinda confused

I always thought Rondo and mud where the same but HaloGoddes kinda confused me

they are...



but if it still doesnt make sense...



Rondo- vague category of any mixture of resin+bondo



Mud- vague category of any mixture of resin+bondo

 

[iron mang]

they are...



but if it still doesnt make sense...



Rondo- vague category of any mixture of resin+bondo



Mud- vague category of any mixture of resin+bondo

oh my bad, i kinda got confused too when I asked you my question. What I meant to ask was: how is the effectiveness of using rondo (mud)? I want to skip the fiberglass cloth and just slush the mud inside the helmet. the cloth is a pain in the butt because it sticks to my latex gloves

 

[momoss]

oh my bad, i kinda got confused too when I asked you my question. What I meant to ask was: how is the effectiveness of using rondo (mud)? I want to skip the fiberglass cloth and just slush the mud inside the helmet. the cloth is a pain in the butt because it sticks to my latex gloves

I'm interested in an answer to this question as well. My armor is all pepped and I'm just saving money to buy the hardening materials. I was originally going to just fiberglass it but this rondo method has gotten me curious. Now I'm wondering weather I should buy the fiberglass cloth or not.

 

[Roadwarrior]

What I do instead of using fiberglass I use DryWall Mesh Tape, think of it like Steel re-bar and the rondo the cement And I just found out that if you only put 12 drops of the resin hardener and some of the red cream hardener(The body filler one(So you can tell if it's mixed) works great for about half a plastic party cup worth's of rondo. It works so well that 12 drops might be too much, I think 6 would do(Or less even).



Edit:Also I use a 4:1 or whatever Bondo:Resin mix so it's kind of thick.

 

[Heatshock]

basically mud galssing/rondo are the same stuff in my book. It basically is a mix of the resin to traditioanl bondo to get it more runny. I wouldnt stick to any fixed proportion, in fact just mix it up in any combination to get the runniness you want. If you look at FG resin and Bondo - the basic solvent compenent is the same (or at least it is in the UK).



as for FG or not to FG - it depends. I use my peices for costuming and not paint ballin. Still, I tend to go for at least 1 layer of FG, sometimes more if I want it more rigid.



FG is always a pain to work with. Cant escape it. Its messy, Its toxic. For those hard to reach corner - I use FG chopped strand mesh - this stuff:

.



I use disposable washing up gloves and throw em after each FG session. In fact, evne my brushes are thrown.



I like FG CSM so much, I use it for everything. Its even more fiddley than cloth, but can be sqooshed into corners etc very effectively. Its cheap (I mean I got rolls of the stuff left over from my last purchase). And can be cut into any shape required.



every1 likes to use cloth. I personally find it hard to get em into corners etc. What abt the smoothness I hear you say? I slosh a thin layer of resin at the end. I tried very thin runny rondo as well. Still experimenting on that one.



Nate

 

[LMNOspartan]

When mud/rondo glassing do you put the fiberglass on the very top of the rondo evenly? Or do you push it through to the paper or just uneven as long as it is stuck in there somewhere?



oh and i would be using fiberglass cloth



thanks!

 

[sdhoigt]

1- FG is always a pain to work with. Cant escape it. Its messy, Its toxic. For those hard to reach corner - I use FG chopped strand mesh - this stuff:

.



I like FG CSM so much, I use it for everything. Its even more fiddley than cloth, but can be sqooshed into corners etc very effectively. Its cheap (I mean I got rolls of the stuff left over from my last purchase). And can be cut into any shape required.



2- every1 likes to use cloth. I personally find it hard to get em into corners etc. What abt the smoothness I hear you say? 3- I slosh a thin layer of resin at the end. I tried very thin runny rondo as well. Still experimenting on that one.

1. FG chopped strand mesh is also called fiberglass mat... its what i used in my helmet
2. people like cloth because its easier to work with using resin, and is better for the novice fiberglasser
3. thats essentially what i did with my helm (except i used rondo... worked really well)... you can see because its so smooth on the top

When mud/rondo glassing do you put the fiberglass on the very top of the rondo evenly? Or do you push it through to the paper or just uneven as long as it is stuck in there somewhere?



oh and i would be using fiberglass cloth



thanks!

the fiberglass doent need to be even, because the gaps will be filled with the mud and the mud itself is a really hard plastic. i wiggled my fiberglass around to saturate it, then poured extra mud on top to completely over saturate it and to have a smooth finish... but it sometimes requires a spoon to slide and spread the FG and mud into place

 

[ceramicist]

Im definitely going to use this on my armor, I like anything that cuts the time down. Thanks for the very thorough step-by-step.

 

[llinformerll]

What I do instead of using fiberglass I use DryWall Mesh Tape, think of it like Steel re-bar and the rondo the cement And I just found out that if you only put 12 drops of the resin hardener and some of the red cream hardener(The body filler one(So you can tell if it's mixed) works great for about half a plastic party cup worth's of rondo. It works so well that 12 drops might be too much, I think 6 would do(Or less even).



Edit:Also I use a 4:1 or whatever Bondo:Resin mix so it's kind of thick.

How does that stuff work that you just mentioned?

 

[LMNOspartan]

Ok awesome thanks! i'll just plop em in then!

 

[Roadwarrior]

How does that stuff work that you just mentioned?

The mesh tape? Well, it's a self adhesive tape so that's a huge plus, I usually use 1 to 2 layer's of it so the rondo has more to grab on to, here's a pic:

[attachment=15867icture 918.jpg]