Raziel Azarak
New Member
You can brush on rondo, depending on the mix ratio.I did it with my mask.use less resin.still came out smooth!
"Help!" for: Fiberglassing, Resin, & Bondo
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Assassin3698
Member
I meant I was going to brush it on the inside only, it would be almost impossible to get it in that area that way. And I wasn't referring to the side vent, there is an area near the mouth that is very challenging to get to, an inverted area. As for the rondo I was going to go for the more liquid consistancy, and follow his steps. And thanks for the thing about digging, there are a few indents not included in the pep file on the HAZOP helm.
Yeah, a good layer of rondo on the inside first, then two layers of fiberglass (To keep the rondo from cracking) and another layer of rondo (to cover the prickly fiberglass, and you'll have an indestructible helmet with a lot of room to cut into without punching through.
Assassin3698
Member
So for the inside your saying: rondo-->fiberglass-->fiberglass-->rondo.
As for the outside it's gonna be: resin-->bondo
Correct?
As for the outside it's gonna be: resin-->bondo
Correct?
Yeah, going from outside to inside it goes
bondo -> resin -> cardstock -> resin(optional) -> rondo -> fiberglass -> fiberglass -> rondo -> your head
The premise of this method is that, the first layer of rondo gives you a buffer zone to cut into for detail lines and what-not, as well as smoothing the inside of the helmet. Fiberglass doesn't hug corners nicely, and by filling the helmet with rondo, you essentially cover most of the corners, or weaken their sharpness, allowing the fiberglass to layer more evenly, which prevents air bubbles which can ruin a piece. The last layer of rondo is more for comfort, as it smooths over the fiberglass inside, hiding any prickles fiberglass can make in the process.
You really want to use at least two layers of fiberglass, because rondo alone is too brittle to handle drops or wanging it on a table corner. With the fiberglass, at least if the rondo cracks, the glass will hold it together for patching. This can happen if you drop a piece with JUST rondo in it:
bondo -> resin -> cardstock -> resin(optional) -> rondo -> fiberglass -> fiberglass -> rondo -> your head
The premise of this method is that, the first layer of rondo gives you a buffer zone to cut into for detail lines and what-not, as well as smoothing the inside of the helmet. Fiberglass doesn't hug corners nicely, and by filling the helmet with rondo, you essentially cover most of the corners, or weaken their sharpness, allowing the fiberglass to layer more evenly, which prevents air bubbles which can ruin a piece. The last layer of rondo is more for comfort, as it smooths over the fiberglass inside, hiding any prickles fiberglass can make in the process.
You really want to use at least two layers of fiberglass, because rondo alone is too brittle to handle drops or wanging it on a table corner. With the fiberglass, at least if the rondo cracks, the glass will hold it together for patching. This can happen if you drop a piece with JUST rondo in it:
Assassin3698
Member
Thanks, you're the greatest.
But didn't you say you were gonna run a test of something today? Just curious if you did, and how it went.
But didn't you say you were gonna run a test of something today? Just curious if you did, and how it went.
SergantTinkers
Jr Member
Quick question about the wonders of fiberglass: As some of us know, fiberglass can become quite prickly! So, to get rid of these little spurs, is it at all recommended to use a dremel tool (with the correct protective gear, of course)? Also, how much rondo would you recommend necessary after the fiberglass layers have been put on?
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How much rondo after fiberglassing? It's a personal choice really. If you have fiberglassed (not just resined), you don't "need" the Rondo. Rondo over fiberglass really doesn't add much strength, but it does smooth the roughness of the fiberglass and give you a little more thickness to you part to cut details into. Recommend you Dremel the spurs and then give a single layer of rondo to even things out. Still not a universal answer though.
Redshirt
What weight fiberglass cloth should I get? I see lots of options available from 1.5oz to 10oz. I assume the heavier weight fiberglass will take more resin to impreg, and generally be more difficult to maneuver, but at the same time I don't want too light of a fiberglass that won't add anything structurally. Suggestions/Opinions?
It's all your preference.
I see two options:
1) quick, lightweight and dirty - Lighter fiberglass mat will hug corners more easily, but will tend to be a lot harder to work with (flaking off, getting in your lungs and hurting you, etc), it also is not as reliable, and has the risk of getting air bubbles.
2) slow, heavier, and moddable - Doing a layer of rondo first inside, and then two layers of fiberglass will give you a very strong piece, and will let you use fiberglass cloth, which is VERY easy to work with, and won't get all over the place like mat does. It also allows you to cut modifications into the helmet's outside surface (detail lines, notches not included in the pep model, etc) without punching holes in your piece.
The structure and strength won't matter much, especially if you are doing 2+ layers of fiberglass (which you should).
I recommend the second options, because there is virtually zero chance of getting airbubbles under the pepakura, which is the death of the helmet. The rondo should cover the entire inside of the helmet, and protect it from fiberglass air bubbles.
I see two options:
1) quick, lightweight and dirty - Lighter fiberglass mat will hug corners more easily, but will tend to be a lot harder to work with (flaking off, getting in your lungs and hurting you, etc), it also is not as reliable, and has the risk of getting air bubbles.
2) slow, heavier, and moddable - Doing a layer of rondo first inside, and then two layers of fiberglass will give you a very strong piece, and will let you use fiberglass cloth, which is VERY easy to work with, and won't get all over the place like mat does. It also allows you to cut modifications into the helmet's outside surface (detail lines, notches not included in the pep model, etc) without punching holes in your piece.
The structure and strength won't matter much, especially if you are doing 2+ layers of fiberglass (which you should).
I recommend the second options, because there is virtually zero chance of getting airbubbles under the pepakura, which is the death of the helmet. The rondo should cover the entire inside of the helmet, and protect it from fiberglass air bubbles.
I was wondering about the bondo step. I have seen videos where people say to only bondo certain parts, but on the forums lots of pictures i have seen look like they're entirely coated in it. Also I was wondering about our safety procedures, our masks are paint and pesticides respirators and the package indicates they protect against formaldahyde and stuff, and we could rarely smell the resin while working with it. Any ideas if we have the right one? Finally, will these work with sanding, or will the disposable ones work?
You have the right mask for working with organic vapors (which is what you want). That mask also works with things like sawdust/sanding/resin dust, but, it's kind of expensive to use it for that, you'd be just as well off using a good dust mask and eye protection, and it would be cheaper.
Generally you only bondo the areas you want to smooth or shape. So if you have an area that's flat, and you're happy with it, there's no reason to bondo it.
It sometimes looks like it, but this usually is the result of people using it in lots of small areas that are scattered all over the helmet. Or, at the very least, you shouldn't cover up any edges or details that you want to keep.
Probably. If you're in the US, the gas filter should have a black label. Here, this might help: https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B4E...y00YjNmLTliNDktZDQ3NDc0MTRiY2Y2/edit?hl=en_US
However...
...gas filters do not protect against particles. You need particle filters for sanding (or gas/particle combination filters for both steps).
Cabooseforever
New Member
2 part question.
1.What type of resin do you use (is it cheap or expensive)
2. Is it safe to use outside or will I need to find a breathing filter?
1.What type of resin do you use (is it cheap or expensive)
2. Is it safe to use outside or will I need to find a breathing filter?
1. Depends where you are, but go to any automotive supply store and ask for polyester fiberglass resin, and you'll get it. As a rule of thumb, if it has a picture of a boat on it, it's good stuff (means it's marine grade) A good sized can will cost you around 20-30 US dollars. Here's a picture of the de-facto can most people buy:
2. Only aqua resin is safe to use indoors or outdoors, but it's very expensive, very hard to find, and not very strong or reliable. The stuff pictured above, and 99% of all resins will require you wear a respirator. Dust filters (the paper with straps to cover your mouth and nose) are NOT going to do anything for you. It has to be a cartridge using ORGANIC filtering respirator.
Good luck! Feel free to ask for any elaboration!
You need both at the same time for spraying stuff around, so it makes sense to combine them. But generalising this into a: "Every A filter is also a P filter", is simply wrong an will create even more confusion than is already there.
Most people use polyester resin, which is relatively cheap. I'd wear a respirator even when using it outside.
Try Aqua-Resin, if you want something non-toxic, but that will be more on the expensive side.
Skullptura
Member
I would just like to point out a fact I found while experimenting with different methods of fiberglassing and ronodo'ing. I like to experiment with every idea and method i find on this site just to see HOW it fails or succeeds and develop a mathod that works for me and maybe a few others when I get something to work. That way I can share it around. One particular EPIC FAIL I discovered is that you should NOT EVER put rondo in a papercraft item without fibreglassing the outside first. The whole thing looked good for about five minutes. Thats when the resin in rondo mix decided to dissolve the glue and the entire spartan chest piece collapsed. I DO NOT reccommend this method lol.
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