Ithica said:
I am molding my own work and casting most parts. The stuff I don't have, great friends do so getting suits is not an issue with me. I already have and MC, 3/4 BUsa, 1/2 Arbiter and plenty of helmets...lol. It is the principial of it all. It is being worked on right now. He does seem willing to help.
Ithica
I'm very big on the "principal of it all" thing myself, so I know exactly what you mean, buddy. It pains me to hear you had to have such a bad experience, but from the sound of things the seller is willing to rectify the situation. Hope it all works out for you in the end.
juliet76 said:
It's good to hear that he/she seems willing to settle this matter with you Dave...
But still! It shouldn't have happened in the first place. If someone is willing to trade in the classifieds or anywhere on the forum with other members there is a level of quality and a time frame that is acceptable, and then there is one that is not. And what you have recieved is not. I'd like to think that someone here, on this forum, that is capable of creating their own armour, molding it, and casting it is intelligent enough to be aware of what an acceptable level of quality is in a product that they recieve payment for. And again- that is not. Rushed or not. And on the rushing point- how is 5 1/2 months rushed? If you advertise that you can supply another member an item that you have/make then you better be ready to do it the second you recieve payment (at the latest). I mean half that stuff was still tacky!
I'm going to have to leave it there I'm getting more annoyed then Ithica. But let this be a note-
Your fellow 405th members are your friends and your peers. We are NOT here to take advantage of and rip each other off. Save that for the real world, here we're trying to build a community that helps, takes care of, and supports one another. Be a part of that. Be a part of something special. Be a part of the 405th.
Wow... all very well said, my friend. I couldn't have said it any better myself. If I'd posted here before you, I could definately see myself having said just that.
Adam said:
I laugh only because I can imagine what each party is thinking. The situation can still be saved. Just seems like people were so excited to get deals made, that no one took the time to ensure it would go smoothly.
I'm the first to admit, I get in over my head on projects some times. But if you need help, ask for help. And make sure you keep honest with people. Like Joe said, we're dealing with friends here. So we all gotta be happy.
Very true. I've admittedly done the same thing on occasion, taking on too much project-wise in too short a time, which results in delays in getting things to people. I really make an effort to not have that happen often, and if it does I try to resolve matters before it becomes an issue for anyone.
Sean Bradley said:
Sometimes it's tough to know what to expect until the box arrives. This seems to be a frequent symptom of people doing buy/sell/trades before they're done with what they're exchanging.
Now I've only been burned once or twice, but I'm thinking that the best way to avoid this ever happening to anyone is to demand that deals only be made with finished part, accompanied by photos. Might be a good rule of thumb that if the goods don't match the photo, a refund is in order. We can't police it here, but discussing the issue (as in this unfortunate case) is how we establish precedent for how we should handle this as a community.
Glad you're able to turn a negative into a positive Dave.
I too have been burned the odd time or two my eight years in this hobby. Good suggestion there, btw.
DogWizard said:
I feel for you - I was burned in exactly the same way a while back. Unfortunately I chose to keep it private which I have regretted ever since. Good job in getting your point across without freaking out.
We just need to use it as what it is - a very unfortunate circumstance that has brought this issue out into the open where it can be addressed. We need to use this opportunity as a community to fix it - for Dave as well as the rest of the membership.
I know that the 405th does not sell armor but I think it would be in our best interests as a group to have a "Good Trader Experience/Bad Trader Experience" subforum in the Classifieds. Multiple other sites I frequent (items in the $500-$20K range) use this as a way for members to share their experiences and hopefully give a heads-up when a deal goes bad (for whatever reason) or when a deal goes well for all parties involved.
These sites also do not sell anything and the Admins/Mods are not responsible for the deals - only for checking the content of the posts and making sure that is is factual in nature rather than a mindless rant. Heck - even the RPF rarely uses the BanHammer or administrative censure but still allows "good/poor experience" posts as long as they are informational in nature. We have a stickied list of "Banned Members" that doesn't seem half as useful as this would be. Just my suggestion and I hope that the Admin/Mod team will think about it as at least one possible solution...
Sorry it had to happen to you and I hope it works out - on a brighter note, you should be receiving a box here in a few days that should bring your smile back...
Good Luck,
-D
Edited for removal of non-constructive and easily misconstrued comment... Sorry...
Great idea, DW! It's the same set-up on the other prop forums I've been a long-time member of, and I definately think that would be a worthwhile consideration for this community as well.
One of the other forums, aside from having a "Good Traders/Bad Traders" thread, also has a thread where people having issues with a transaction have a place where they can clear up the details and resolve the situation. It's a stated rule that only the trader/seller and buyer can post in that thread, each explaining their side of it and then through civil correspondence there can sort things out.
Any posts made in that thread by someone
not involved are immediately removed, plain and simple.
Now, that may be too public a venue for here, but I just wanted to illustrate that as 1) it keeps the two involved parties in regular contact (having the buyer posting publicly doesn't allow the trader/seller to simply ignore them; if it's posted publicly, it's known that a response has to be made in a timely manner), and 2) the Admin/Mod group is able to more easily monitor the content of the members' communicaes to ensure it doesn't get out of hand or downright ugly.
Another benefit to the public resolution thread is that it shows the rest of the community whether or not the trader/seller is a decent individual, willing to resolve the issue. Or, in some cases, has shown just how rude and unreliable the person is. Seeing the actions (or lack thereof) of the trader/seller helps others to gauge whether or not they should do business with him/her.
Going back to the "Good Traders/Bad Traders" list/thread, along with people briefly recounting their experiences with various other members, on this other forum there is also a grading system; +1 rep, -1 rep, or neutral. These points are colour-coded green, red and yellow and are applied to a list of known traders/sellers in the first post on the first page. A quick glance at this list also helps others to know who they should or shouldn't deal with.
These two stickied threads are posted at the top of the "For Sale" forum on the site. Anyway, just an addition to DW's idea.
Das Brutus said:
We can't witchhunt, we can't flame, so all we can be is sympethtic to Ithica. The frustration he is feeling has no real outlet... he can't confront the person face to face, PMing or calling is the only way to contact and is probably slow in response and tedious. I have much respect for Dave, his self control, and restraint... The Wife is proud of him (that's YOU, Dave) for keeping his composure and professionalism... as neither of us would have remained so calm and non-violent as you have demonstrated in this vid rant (read my signature)...
We both hope your finger is all good... I'm sure you have plenty of super glue at the house to take care of it.
As do I! There aren't many people I know in the hobby that would've handled this sort of situation with such a degree of professionalism, cool-headed-ness and restraint. Most people are prone to blow a gasket whenever they get burned. My hat's off to you for conducting yourself in a proper and civil manner, my friend.
However, the sad reality of it is, being in the hobby we're in, there are always going to be the odd person or two that will do this. With some, it's an honest mistake, but others it's intentional.
For the most part, everyone I've come across in this hobby are honest and trustworthy, not in it to make a profit but simply share what they can with others for the love of the subject matter (ie. Star Trek, HALO). But there are those that would take advantage of people, advertise their products to be something they're not, always provide below-par quality items then run away with payment and avoid any contact with their past customers.
The reason being, they got what they wanted, so to hell with whoever they grossly, unfairly screwed over. I've seen it happen more than once, and is just not kewl.
Let me clarify that I'm not implying the other party involved here is like that (don't want to unnecessarily offend, or have them think I'm accusing them of the same).
I'm just making a general comment based on past observations from other situations. In this case, we don't know the exact circumstances behind why what was sent to Ithica was sent to him. It is not really our place to know all the details, only that there was an issue here, and at this point steps are being taken to resolve it to the satisfaction of everyone involved.
Okay... I think I'll shut up now lol
