Entry-Level Costumes

[DogWizard]

So, howsabout those entry-level costumes? What do you think a good maximum price for one would be?

It actually may not be that bad - there seems to be a lot of airsoft/paintball crossover so it stands to reason that a lot of the BDU/Camo requirements for a basic Marine/ODST may already be in place. Assuming Halo-Specific gear was purchased and not made by hand the costs could still be fairly reasonable. While plain BDU's may not suffice, BDU's plus an accurate helmet ($150-200), basic weapon (pistol - $50-60), and torso armor (unknown - let's call it $250-300) would go a long way in creating the overall effect. So call it $500.00 (assuming that the actual "clothing" was already in place). Then the rest of the armor could be added gradually to "upgrade". We won't know until someone actually gets some non-Mjolnir armor up and running but assuming that this rollout tracks with what the 501st did, economies of scale will set in quickly if someone (not the 405th of course) offers a standardized kit. The more that are made, the lower the cost...

 

[NZTK]

Someone may end up offering a high quality marine kit (very soon actually), I think it would serve as a good starting point for those who dont want to pay the big dollars for spartan suits, it would be an ideal solution for a costume under 1000

 

[Primal Weyland]

You know what? I actually had a long, detailed argument written out here about how we're taking the wrong route by trying to emulate the 501st.

But just as I was about to post, I realised. It doesn't matter a jot about what I actually think, because in the end, the people that make the rules are the people that have the suits. Now, the war pigs have the power - and in the end, it's a matter of those people with good armors setting nigh-impossible benchmarks, in terms of workmanship, finance, and timescale.

So, hey. I'll make my armor set, I'll turn up to conventions looking like I just pulled the set out of the mould, and I'll dress to impress. But when half of the fanbase leaves because they can't participate through impossible goals, and the other half wonders why the armor community is stagnating, I just want you to know that I bloody called it.

 

[DogWizard]

You know what? I actually had a long, detailed argument written out here about how we're taking the wrong route by trying to emulate the 501st.

That's only your personal opinion - what makes your opinion the right one? Or any more valid than someone elses? Progress comes from discussion and compromise - not from throwing down the gauntlet and saying "I'm right and you're wrong and I'll be first in line to tell you I told you so if something bad happens"

And come on - war pigs? Since it's those same "war pigs" that created this site (and work to maintain it every day) in the first place, I think that it's in pretty poor taste to insult them for their efforts. As a matter of fact I do think that it's those people who should be setting the standards, you know why? They have already established a high level of commitment to this site, the community, and their personal armor standards - who better to lead by example?

Can we please stop bickering about this and get back to discussing potential options for entry-level costumes?

 

[slavefive]

Actually, let's look to other costuming clubs- what's the basic cost of putting together a standard 501st-legal stormtrooper?
I seem to remember armor kits being around 600$- what's the total cost, though, all the strapping, undersuit, etc?

...probably correct...for a basic TK suit...maybe around $450.00-650.00 depending on your connections...still even though the FX is good it is still not 100% correct...albeit the original suits were total dookie...

...if you wish to upgrade the bobblehead bucket to a more normal size you are looking at $300+...

$125.00 TK Boots (please dont use elvis boots)
$100.00 Undersuit (I prefer to use the 1 pc dive undersuit)
$50.00 neckseal (quality vs the cheap ebay version)
$50.00 gloves (quality gloves)
$50-$250.00 for a blaster...
$50+ for builing materials...straps etc...

...I would say a good $1000-$1200 for a basic clean TK...and I mean basic...

 

[Assassin716]

Have you seen Mr. Westerfields his is pretty rock solid looks exactly as its supposed and hes pricing it at around $500-600, fairly cheap when compared to others of the same high quality

 

[metalsplinter2]

...probably correct...for a basic TK suit...maybe around $450.00-650.00 depending on your connections...still even though the FX is good it is still not 100% correct...albeit the original suits were total dookie...

...if you wish to upgrade the bobblehead bucket to a more normal size you are looking at $300+...

$125.00 TK Boots (please dont use elvis boots)
$100.00 Undersuit (I prefer to use the 1 pc dive undersuit)
$50.00 neckseal (quality vs the cheap ebay version)
$50.00 gloves (quality gloves)
$50-$250.00 for a blaster...
$50+ for builing materials...straps etc...

...I would say a good $1000-$1200 for a basic clean TK...and I mean basic...

Well a good TK set cost more then 1k for a decent one lol I know I was planing on doing it a while back but I went with a Biker scout which is nearly 1k. Besides the point I agree that basic armor should be financial cheap I mean come on our movie didn't even come out yet lol We can't compare star wars which existed for so many years and there fan club armor and props to our armor and props and be expected to be as great as them in 1 shot lol. This going to take time and to throw it out there the Halo universe is pointed towards the gamers mostly I bet you half our parents don't know what Halo is. overall I think that the Chiefs armor should cost the highest because his the chief lol

btw we should be different then the 501st I mean come on if be base our ideas and goals of 501st whats the difference in becoming a branch of the 501st lol.

This should be kept as a entry level where everyone can basically save a few bucks and can be apart of this group I mean if we can't do that our numbers will die very fast. Those of us that can afford very nice armor that's great but think of those who love halo but can't afford to dump 1k on a costume and also most of us I believe most members are between ages of 14-24 (I think could be wrong).

Anyways I still think Halo 1 marines or crew men from the pillar of autumn, Civilian workers would be a nice entry level my opinion

I upload some pics from a previous post on page 6 http://405th.com/forums/index.php?showtopi...0&start=100

 

[CMANavy]

An easy one would be the dress Navy uniforms. Should only come to a few hundred.

Case and point to this whole thing is nothing is going to make it so any one with a budget of $50 can join. You want to look good then you need to spend some money. Time to grow up this is a big boy hobby.

 

[Vrogy]

Elitists: there will be tradeoffs between cost and quality.
Inclusionists: there will be standards.

We're not going to grow quickly with a 1000-dollar barrier to entry.
Pep and bondo suits require too much mind-numbing work; newcomers will be discouraged.

There has to be a balance struck. I think that balance is a 200-300$ marine kit.
What'll be in it?
-instructions
-vacuum-formed plates
-nylon straps and buckles
-foam
-fabric
-patterns
-plastic hardware

To complete it, people will cut out, paint, and detail the armor, cut out and cover the foam, attach buckles and straps, and put it on over their own BDUs.

Kit price breakdown(shipping included): Totals 190$
5-6 24" square polycarbonate pulls: ~80$
10' of 1" nylon strapping: ~10$
10' of 1.5" nylon strapping: ~10$
5 24" square pieces of various foam: 30$
green and black nylon fabric: 40$
printed patterns: 5$
various plastic D-rings and buckles: 15$

Other stuff: Totals 125$
pop rivets: 10$
paint, brushes, etc: 20$
nylon thread, needles: 10$
BDU shirt, pants: 60$
BDU caps: boonie, 'fidel': 15$
405th patches/pins/insignia: 10$

Lots of people will lay down 200$ after a little research and consideration, and a total of 315$ is something many people can afford. Who knows, maybe a better kit can be available with the sewn portions already completed, so all someone has to do is paint and assemble the kit.
Now if only someone made it available... *whistles*

 

[Sean Bradley]

The bar for standards will be set about mid-range. We don't intend on alienating anyone, however we need to have some consistency when we show up at events. People that have high quality suits will be ahead of the curve, and those that need improvement will be given exact instruction on what they need to do to meet the standards. The devil will be in the details.

As Vrogy has suggested, there will be affordable alternatives for entry level costumes. Expensive costumes will not be mandatory.

Nothing has been carved in stone yet, and this discussion has allowed us a good view of what the forums want form the standards. Thanks for that.

 

[NZTK]

Reminds me of I line I read in a book somewhere

"It is not the job of the Librarian, to give people what they want. They deserve so much better"

 

[metalsplinter2]

An easy one would be the dress Navy uniforms. Should only come to a few hundred.

Case and point to this whole thing is nothing is going to make it so any one with a budget of $50 can join. You want to look good then you need to spend some money. Time to grow up this is a big boy hobby.

O please who said spending 50 bucks going to do the trick I was thinking in 200-400 range that right there is half my paycheck. Don't try to insult me when you misunderstand me with "Time to grow up this is a big boy hobby ". As a TB I know how much it takes to make a screen accurate but face it we had millions of screen shots, movie, and armor suppliers to make it work piece by piece. We have to basic it off our video game and some of the mini live action clips. lol what did you think when I said save a few bucks?

Boots alone will cost nearly 50 bucks lol

 

[NZTK]

big boy hobby how old are you...

Suffice to say he's a big enough boy to be the GML for Alaska, and so perhaps has a little bit of insight on costuming. Some of you guys would do well to respect your elders....

 

[slavefive]

Suffice to say he's a big enough boy to be the GML for Alaska, and so perhaps has a little bit of insight on costuming. Some of you guys would do well to respect your elders....

...very true...the lack of respect is more prominent here on this forum...the 501st does not look friendly to this type of behavior...there is no room for this, especially when the 405th is a relatively new group that is trying to grow to someday become official...

...I can see how some of the long time members here are feeling regarding the sudden influx of armorers and 501st people making the transition to the Halo community...you read posts regarding quality and how much has been spent...age requirements...these are things that we as 501st members have experienced...

...granted perhaps it is not needed at this time to have spot on armor...or do you need to spend a ton of money...but in this hobby you get what you pay for and you have to have the ability to make something...simple as that...i would say there are only a handful of people that can make pep look as good as higher end armor...or course as I said before there are some people that do not have the ability to make higher end armor look good either...

...please instead view it as a way for this community to better itself...reading comments about the "elitist attitude" and that "molded armor = circle jerk" saddens me...perhaps I may have sounded harsh when I said you will need to spend x amount of money to make higher end armor...I tend to call it things pretty straight fwd and I was basing it on my personal experiences...

Laters
Lewis

 

[Primal Weyland]

Suffice to say he's a big enough boy to be the GML for Alaska, and so perhaps has a little bit of insight on costuming. Some of you guys would do well to respect your elders....

*eyebrow raise*

Please. The 501st may be more established, but from what I've seen of things here, and of the attitude of a lot of the TKers, I'm sorry to say that I've actually been put off the idea of even looking into the 501st. Most of the members have their heads screwed on where it matters - in the rest, you appear as snooty elitists bigging up in the armor-making playground. And to the following from slavefive, "the 501st does not look friendly to this type of behavior", all I can say in response is a very selective four-lettered curseword followed immediately by 'you, you elitist' and then another seven-lettered word describing an illigitimate child. We're not the 501st, and in my humble opinion, the 501st can enjoy a meal of my own posterior on a fine silver platter. The 501st doesn't matter - we're not the 501st. We're the 405th. The 501st shouldn't even come into the equation, save for those rare times the 501st and the 405th meet up at a convention.

Oh, there go even more toes being stepped on.

I have every respect for a person that can put together a detailed armor set, whether that person has £5 or £500. I have every respect for a person that has the time and the patience to sit down with less experienced and well-off people and help them make their efforts all they can be, and I have the utmost respect for a person that's got experience in armor. I also have respect for the 501st in that they've got years of experience and skill behind a lot of their members.

I have no respect for a person that shows up and says 'hey, I got this cracking armor set, so shut up and listen to me because I'm better than you and if you don't have what I have then you're no good', and I have no respect for a community that shows up acting like a pushy older brother.

And that's what this is about - experienced people sneering down at those less experienced because they got the early start. Pepakura or plastic... doesn't matter to me personally. I intend to make armor, and sell it off to help those who can't make it, and embody the spirit of 'armor, honor, unity'. What I'll never do is turn around to those less experienced and cut them off - where's the honor and unity in that?

As for the original topic point: 'starter' armors are a great idea to involve the people who can't make MJOLNIR armor or don't want to. I personally intend to do both sets, and I'll report back when I have some progress.

 

[slavefive]

Primal Weyland...you seem very angry and hostile regarding the 501st...I am not at all all saying that the 501st is perfect...it has its share of problems...more then I would like point out...like anything you have the good and the bad...same goes on here the 405th...the 501st is a good model to use and to branch out from there...obviously it works...does not mean it will work here, but you can at least learn from it...

The use of colorful metaphors to decribe this or that is not needed...what does that solve???...to clear the air, if your post is geared towards me you are completely clueless...you have no idea how much personal time and money I have spent to better the 501st hobby locally...to the point where I literally no longer participate in local gigs...being thanked by people that you help is great...being taken advantage of by people is quite another...same goes for BishopX...whatever I have done you can easily multiply that by 100x...

Did members of the UK garrison somehow offend you???...I know quite a few of them and the ones I have had the pleasure to meet have been great...then again you always will have the rotten eggs...

All in all a variety of armor and costumes is best...regardless if it is expensive, affordable, or homemade...so long as it looks good enough to be believable and the members are having fun that is what counts...bottomline is that we are people dressing up as fictional characters as a hobby...no one person is better then the other...just the attitudes that people bring to the table...

 

[Renga]

Ok first off, if you want to present a credible constructive argument you certainly don’t disrespect, imply vulgar language or label people’s character just at face value since you simply don’t have enough information about the persons to make a valid assertion, it’s frankly in poor taste and embarrassing to the community good people here are trying to build.

Lewis eloquently and respectful cited this earlier and you then countered back with a tirade of disparaging foul remarks.

While there are some concerns and your own bias opinions on the 501st it doesn’t represent the majority of the individuals who simply enjoy the camaraderie and fandom as we all do in a group. Also there is nothing elitist or snobbish about the charity work they do for various nonprofit organizations like city of hope, make a wish, the Red Cross and children’s hospitals.

While this is a community in the fledging stages of developing and still finding its way and growth is a learning experience with many bumps in the road one thing we should not lose sight of is a clear sense of conduct when it comes to treating individuals with respect and having standards for behavior they don’t speak ill of the group.

 

[Adam]

Since my original post was deleted by a Nazi moderator with über post-deleting powers, I'll repeat for the emphasis here.

Moulded armor = circlejerk.

Long and short: If you people want to make moulded armor, by all means. But don't wave it in my face and tell me I have to have the armor equivalent of a Porche to be in the club, or by hell I'll be off to start the armor equivalent of the Lada Appreciation Society.

I disagree. Chris Bryan didn't spend millions his armor and it turned out great. He took a lot of time, and a lot of research to get the armor as fantastic as he got it.

But, if we're to be taken seriously by anyone, we can't have straight pepakura/paper armor running around. It needs to be reinforced and smoothed out. I'm not responsible for how much money each of you make. If you can't afford to do this hobby, no one is going to force you into it.

It's not elitist to strive for high quality. We are going to be alienating people yes, but compare it to Sony Playstation. Do you think they said "oh, we can't release a $599 console, because we'll alienate the gamers without jobs, lets just re-release the ps2 in a new case"

I'd elaborate on this conversation if I thought it would do any good. All I can say is sorry. You are going to HAVE to have a high quality costume to be in the 405th. Armor or otherwise.

 

[CMANavy]

This is starting to become more trouble than its worth. This keeps up there will never be an "offical" 405th

A huge point most people are missing is that if anyone openly starts selling armor Microsoft is going to hit you with a C&D real fast. Making the whole "into" kit a pipe dream.

As for me, yeah I am the GML for Alaska and have a lot of experiance building armor. Am I as good as BishopX, Slave5, Slave1pilot or any of the Legendary armor crew? No but I am hopping to be some day. But none of that matters at this point.

 

[Assassin716]

We should take in to consideration about costumes not involving armor, like fatigues and dress uniform
right now im actually shopping around for some suits that are close to the Halo Navy Dress Uniform as pictured below

but something as well as these i believe should be allowed for those on a smaller budget

just my two cents, anything with in the games i think should be allowed, and anything in imagination should be allowed to an extent